Topic: Airmar transducer for Helix 12" Si GPS

[migdolf]

Hi,

I just bought a new Helix 12"model which is pretty awesome! I read from the Humminbird website that Airmar transducers could be used with the Humminbird devices and is there any adapter cables for the Airmar transducer? I believe Airmar does not have the same connection type as Humminbird...My friend use Airmar TM150 with Lowrance HDS9 seiries and the view is really nice with that transducer and I thought it would be nice to try Airmar with a Humminbird unit. Does anyone have tried already this and if have, what are experiences?

-Migdolf

[rnvinc]

Only cut and splice ...

Here is info ...

http://www.humminbird.com/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=9674

Rickie

[migdolf]

Hi Rickie,

Thanks for the prompt reply! I might order 1 Airmar transducer and give it a try. Have anyone from here tried Airmar transducer with a Humminbird unit?

Another question is that does the Helix 12" SI unit have only 2 available frequency modes for the Chirp? Now that I have had the unit for couple of weeks and on with few fishing trips it sounds to me a bit strange that there is only mid range from 75 to 95 khz & 175-225 khz and no other options except to use mid & high frequencies at the same time.

As per the specification for the Helix 12" units there should be "1kW / Built-in Range of 28kHz-490kHz on the HELIX 12 DI to a range of 28kHz-250kHz on the Helix 12 SI and GPS. Depths down to 3,500 ft". So, how can I adjust the range to my unit from 28 kHz to 250 kHz since it is the Helix 12 SI unit?   

-Mikko

[rnvinc]

I'm not sure how to read those specs either ...yet ... we will learn more as more users explore those options ...

The model unit you choose will determine which "sweep bands" are available in that unit ...

Here is info from the HELIX 12 manual ...


Here is the HELIX 9, 10, 12 manual ...
http://www.humminbird.com/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=7708

I would guess you would need to call Airmar because they will ask you questions pertaining to your target depths and target uses to determine which of their xducers would contain frequency sweep bands that match the sweep bands available in your chosen unit ...and beam angles to best suit your Sonar needs ...

http://www.airmar.com/contact.html

Rickie

[migdolf]

Thanks Rickie for the table and I have checked the same but at the humminbird Chirp website they are saying that 1kW broadband device can be operated between 28 and 250 kHz. This seems to be meaning for the optional transducer only? However, it is strange that Chirp can't be operated between 28-250 kHz with normal transducer...Airmar TM150 would be nice to try but first it would be nice to know is it possible to operate all the frequencies from 28-250, otherwise it is quite useless to try Airmar TM150 since it uses 95-155 kHz and Helix don't have it. At least for the standard transducer.
http://www.humminbird.com/Category/Technology/CHIRP_FW/
http://www.humminbird.com/Products/HELIX-12-CHIRP-SI-GPS/

E.g. Lowrance guys use the Airmar TM150 with medium Chirp range between 95-155kHz and sometimes with locked 105 kHz. This frequency rate is missing from the Helix series and I have seen really nice arches with my friend's Lowrance HDS Gen 3, even in shallow water. I have faced problems when going shallow water under 8 meters(~24 feet) with High Chirp and deeper from that the device is making nice arches.

-Mikko   

[Bob B]

I don't have the Helix chirp, but I'm pretty sure you can select a sweep range ..... and narrow that frequency to any single frequency in the band.

[rnvinc]

Sfw1960 has the HELIX 12 CHIRP SI ...

I will get him to check his unit and post here ...

Rickie

[sfw1960]

MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMmarketing!!!   

Info from the manual is correct Rickie, as is the web page.

The STD HDSI offers 75-95 and 175/225 KHz as does my DI unit (175/225)

Depending on which XDCR is selected - there's a pretty good range UP TO 250KHz on the SI machine.
The Helix12DI however offers the top end  of the spectrum with 490KHz (Not the SI unit or likely the "STD" 2D Helix Chirp Sonar GPS).

PB is running like Peanut Butter right now, so be patient or try later....


















PB library of Chirp Menu options:

http://s189.photobucket.com/user/sfw1960/library/Secret_Squirrel/HeLix12SI_GPS_KVD/HBHLX12SIChirpFreq?sort=3&page=1

[rnvinc]

General marketing sure does make it difficult to get accurate info to the users ...

Thanks Robert ...

Rickie

[sfw1960]

Things are tough all over!   

Glad I could be of service Rickie, you'd do the same for any of us...

I can hardly imagine what monsters the new all Chirp imaging machines will be when they come forth!

RAS

[migdolf]

sfw1960, thank you very much for the information. Thanks to Rickie as well . I was looking the pictures which were taken from your unit and I noticed that e.g. you had 1 picture for medium Chirp 75 to 155 kHz and several other options as well to choose for. Does the SI unit have another place where to select the different range for the Chirp? At least I have not found yet from where to select more options for range...I assume the KVD unit is not different than normal SI unit, if we are talking the HW & SW of the unit? I have the latest SW installed now to my unit, which added some options to device but not any Chirp option or as I said, I'm looking them from the wrong place...

You mentioned also that standard transducer is offering 2 range options for Chirp and do I need to get some other transducer if I want to have more options for choosing the range for Chirp? Does the HB unit automatically recognize a new installed transducer or do I need select correct one from the unit? Which transducer you are using?

Sorry to ask a lot but it would be nice to get the full benefits out of the unit and the manual which came along with the unit did not tell as much I would liked.

-Mikko

[sfw1960]

Yes, for other freq. options you need another XDCR.

You also would lose SI capability with that selection.

If you wanted so use the other freq. options I would have the H12 Sonar GPS and use that networked to an SI unit so you could have both options.

The Airmar XDCRs are pretty expensive, so I doubt I would use a setup outside of stock for me and how I fish.

[migdolf]

Thanks for the reply. Ok, the options are coming along with another XDCR. In my case, if I want to install the Airmar transducer, it will be a additional / separate XDCR, do I still lose the SI? Std. XDCR would be in use for SI and can I select the Airmar from unit options only for the 2D? I would imagine that it would work.. Otherwise it would be quite strange to have option to install Airmar and at the same time lose SI ability.

[sfw1960]

When you select something OTHER that HDSI or Compact SI the transmitter/receiver imaging sections are turned off.

You can use a TS3 XDCR switch to switch back & forth between an Airmar & STD. - but you also have to change XDCR type each time or you risk damage to the unit, hence my statement about a second 2D only H12.

[migdolf]

That's a bit shame that 2 XDCR's are not going to work at the same time. It would be a significant cost to buy a 12" Helix just for the 2D option and on top of that an Airmar XDCR. There is no point of using a switch between the XDCR's and switching selections with the unit on each time. E.g. if you have competition on going, you need to have all gear working flawless without any hassle when trying to find fish.  It would have been great have it working same way as Lowrance devices, where you can select 2 transducers working at the same time, if you want. I believe it would even help if there would option to choose the medium range between 95 to 155 kHz with standard XDCR. Now if the current medium Chirp is selected between 75 to 95 it does not help in shallow water like from 6 feet(~2 meters) to 60 feet(~20 meters) where are fishing a lot in Finland.   

I have seen the difference between normal XDCR and Airmar XDCR with Lowrance equipment and the difference is significant and worth to pay extra money. Humminbird has magnificent Side imaging picture and personally I think the best SI from the market but the DI picture is not so good and it might coming that Helix XDCR does not have own DI crystal and the picture is coming from combined 2 side imaging beams? It is sometimes quite confusing that I see fish arch's with 2d but not with DI and the opposite way. It has been a bit challenging to get good picture from DI view as well.

Personally I would love to have only 1 XDCR but lack of wide mid range and now that I can't even use a commercial XDCR for mid range is a bit set back.   

[sfw1960]

Maybe in the future that will change, I'm just happy I can get a unit repaired unlike the other brand I used to run....

[migdolf]

Hopefully HB would make more options for the Chirp range and for DI picture. I had problems with previous brand and that's why I changed back to HB. The Helix 12 unit itself is really great and if they would fix only few things it would be perfect to my use. Well, now I am only talking about my own personal use so someone else is not having the same problems as I am .

Thanks for all the comments so far, I appreciate a lot!

-Mikko

[sfw1960]

I can run high range 2D Chirp up to 490KHz and run DI  on my H12DI - the SI unit I bought for the SI, I don't mind having the 75-95/175-225.
I don't use 75KHz, but it can slug down a pretty good ping deep - I've used a Sitex and Vexilar @ 75 KHz before...

The other brands may be "good" but I can tune this brand to see differing returns unlike some brands .

If I wanted DEEP salt water sounding, I'd get a regular H12 Chirp (2D) Sonar GPS, run an Airmar low freq. XDCR and boom fish several thousand feet down at 30-40KHz.
Being I am more interested in the close ups of water usually under 60' I would rather have the detailing properties of SI @ 800 KHz than to see over 1000 feet.
I don't mind using 455KHz but once you find something, homing in on the target and getting a good close up shot really tells us a lot.

For you - I'm afraid it can be done, but it's not plug and play now.




The DI unit doesn't lie, if you can't see them with DI and a narrow Chirp spread like I used - then you can't see fish...lol!