Author Topic: Time to Reveal all ! (Read 21678 times)

offroad · « **on:** August 23, 2012, 03:58:44 AM »

l have to blame Rickard he sent me down this wicked path, To try something new ,Into unchartered waters so to speak, What wire goes where ? Sleepless nights What if ? Wost of all ....what if my wife finds out ? Leave things alone ,l can here her saying ,That unit cost a lot of money what if you blow it it ? Thankfully she who must be obeyed didnt find out and it didnt blow up, Its up to 40 hours and still going strong ,So what wicked things have l been up too ? After reading Rickards post about using a Lowrance LSS2 Transducer on a Humminbird unit and being unsatified with the results on my 1197, Emails where exchanged Pms and so forth.. l Set about procuring a Lowrance transducer, NOT a easy task when the purse strings are controlled by the other half .You want what ? A little white lie here and there and bingo One Transducer...Now you need two transducers for this setup, One for SI and the other for 200kz l had a mate that had broken the cable on his HB Transducer and after a bit of arm twisting l was the proud owner of this item Easy fix but dont tell him.....Next l brought the two transducer cable but it was the wrong one and l didnt need it anyway. All this was easy, Well compared to the next bit, What wire goes where ? l am sure if l send Lowrance a email they will tell me the code. What wire does what ? .Wrong.... Ok with the help of Rickard and this board, Multi meter. Light tester and a friend that kept telling me dont let the smoke out or we are doomed .We ventured forth, Nope that dont work.... Try again..... l am sure you get the picture .If at first you dont succeed try again or maybe get other friend. It went something like this ,Only one side The only Di then.... ect ect ,But at last it worked and l am very impressed with results .Thanks again Rickard. Now the area that these shots where taken the water is very turbulent there is a lot of sand movement Thats what you can see in the water column Lots of Rocks too....

ITGEEK · « **Reply #1 on:** August 23, 2012, 08:03:23 AM »

Those images look great.

Do you think the improved image quality
is worth the cost of the lowrance LSS-2 transducer
and the time it took to make it all work?

Rüdiger · « **Reply #2 on:** August 23, 2012, 08:35:47 AM »

Hi

Really good pictures

.
Do you have build a Towfish with the two transducers and how do you have sealed the cable connection ?

mvh
Rüdiger

Rickard · « **Reply #3 on:** August 23, 2012, 09:13:08 AM »

Congratulations Trevor!
I think I was at least as terrified as you when I followed your wire experiments... The HBs are good at confining smoke

.
Rickard

reddog · « **Reply #4 on:** August 23, 2012, 09:24:17 AM »

Could you post an actual screencapture from the unit instead of Humviewer?

Looks great from what im seeing..

offroad · « **Reply #5 on:** August 23, 2012, 12:50:10 PM »

Quote from: Rüdiger on August 23, 2012, 08:35:47 AM

Hi

Really good pictures .
Do you have build a Towfish with the two transducers and how do you have sealed the cable connection ?

mvh
Rüdiger

Rudiger
This unit is for fish finding, So both transducers are attached as per normal to the back of the boat, The wiring diagram will be posted shortly

offroad · « **Reply #6 on:** August 23, 2012, 12:56:26 PM »

Quote from: ITGEEK on August 23, 2012, 08:03:23 AM

Those images look great.

Do you think the improved image quality
is worth the cost of the lowrance LSS-2 transducer
and the time it took to make it all work?

Good point in my case, $300 for that transducer, But cheaper than buying a new Lowrance unit, The image quality has improved heaps on my unit

offroad · « **Reply #7 on:** August 23, 2012, 12:58:19 PM »

Quote from: reddog on August 23, 2012, 09:24:17 AM

Could you post an actual screencapture from the unit instead of Humviewer?

Looks great from what im seeing..

Reddog
yes when l go out again l will take some shots

Roddy · « **Reply #8 on:** August 23, 2012, 01:43:54 PM »

Offroad, NICE. Just goes to show a little time, a little work and no expence spaird can do !

Roddy

Bob B · « **Reply #9 on:** August 23, 2012, 07:39:02 PM »

Great job offroad.....From what I am seeing this transducer works better on a Humminbird unit than it does on a Lowrance unit....it looks like your range was set pretty small....what do the images look like at ranges of 100' or more?

Whistler · « **Reply #10 on:** August 23, 2012, 11:51:48 PM »

I've got a couple of questions about this set up.

1. Does the transducer improve the quality of the down images? (I realize the down facing crystal isn't used but wondered if the apparent improved sensitivity of the LSS2 improves the bird software generated DI)

2. Are the elements in the LSS2 set at the same angle as the elements in the hum ducer?

3. Will the coverage area for the Humminbird with LSS2 transducer remain 86 degrees with this set up? Id hate to lose the ability to see the upper water column that the bird ducer allows me to see.

offroad · « **Reply #11 on:** August 24, 2012, 01:05:51 AM »

DI Works

offroad · « **Reply #12 on:** August 24, 2012, 01:16:38 AM »

Now before we go any further, This set up is for me ,And l am not saying go out and buy a Lowrance Transducer and do as l have done, Different units may bring varying results, What effect this Transducer will have on my unit in say a year , Who knows ? Rickard if he wishes may answer any of those tech questions about beam angles or whatever. Me l am going fishing......

Rickard · « **Reply #13 on:** August 24, 2012, 09:26:45 AM »

Trevor, you really have deserved a moment of solitude and rest after this achievment!

reddog, On my unit the difference is not as obvious on the unit display as with a viewer in a computer. This is what one would expect, because the unit can't show all details given the pixel resolution. But the difference is still clearly discernible so to me there is no alternative to the LSS-2 in any scanning situation.

Bob, You could be right, the image gets better with a HB than with a Lowrance. I have no Lowrance unit so I can't do direct comparisons, but this would be in compliance with wave theory. The Lowrances use the dedicated DI array at the same time as both SI arrays at the same frequency. This provokes lots of interference between all beams. Since a HB doesn't use the DI channel some of this interference is eliminated. There is still some interference between the SI channels, but that's unavoidable in any two-sided sidescanning system.

Whistler, I think offroad answered your first question with the DI images, but one has to make ones own judgment on any differences in DI image quality.
I haven't found any spec on element angles in the LSS-2, but they seem to be similar to the angles in the HB transducers. (In some of the dissected HB transducers the elements were dislocated so.....)
I'm not sure which part of the water column you mean. Since the SI beams overlap (that's why there can be interference between the beams) the whole water column beneath the transducer must be covered. Interference may cause irregularity in the beam pattern, though. In my images I see traces from the surface which means the beam is strong enought (and the transducer sensitive enought) to cover more than 90 degrees. I don't think you will lose any coverage. On the contrary, I think you will gain coverage with this system.

There is a psychological drawback with this crazy system. Once I got the taste for it I became spoiled and now there is no alternative among the standard products. But of course, an exploding unit would be an efficient cure....

Offroad, did you catch anything?

Rickard

Roddy · « **Reply #14 on:** August 24, 2012, 12:52:39 PM »

Offroad,Rickard, Wonderfull work !

Roddy

T.G · « **Reply #15 on:** August 25, 2012, 07:44:18 AM »

hi, are you still able to use 2d at all? & you guys are just brilliant to figure this stuff out, I think it pushes the technology further.
thanks Trevor

Rickard · « **Reply #16 on:** August 25, 2012, 08:15:03 AM »

On behalf of Trevor (and me), thanks all!

T.G.: Yes, 2D is there. It's provided by the 2D downward/depth sensing channel. You need that channel to control ping rate in the system, so it's a necessary feature. All views in the unit are still there. The only difference from normal is the enhanced SI and DI image quality.

Rickard

Whistler · « **Reply #17 on:** August 25, 2012, 08:28:34 AM »

Does anyone have any ideas about where one might e able to purchase the components to fashion an adapter cable that has the necessary Lowrance and Humminbird connectors? I'd much rather build a adapter cable than. It my cables and solder them.

reddog · « **Reply #18 on:** August 25, 2012, 09:28:34 AM »

Quote from: Whistler on August 25, 2012, 08:28:34 AM

Does anyone have any ideas about where one might e able to purchase the components to fashion an adapter cable that has the necessary Lowrance and Humminbird connectors? I'd much rather build a adapter cable than. It my cables and solder them.

Excellent question, and one that should certainly be attainable, but whos going to do it?

Rickard · « **Reply #19 on:** August 25, 2012, 12:29:38 PM »

Quote from: Whistler on August 25, 2012, 08:28:34 AM

Does anyone have any ideas about where one might e able to purchase the components to fashion an adapter cable that has the necessary Lowrance and Humminbird connectors? I'd much rather build a adapter cable than. It my cables and solder them.

I agree this would be much less awkward than cutting transducer cables. In fact, I still haven't cut any cable myself. I use tiny provisional wires and pins and sockets from old computer cables, plus a homemade male HB connector made from hot melt glue. I think one can retrieve the required components for an adapter from a Lowrance and a HB extension cable. Cut the Lowrance extension and solder the socket part to the appropriate wires in the HB extension. Not cheap and not so easy, though.

Or perhaps we should just wait for a long HB transducer? I know they tested with long transducers several years ago, but dropped the concept because the small enhancement in display image quality wasn't worth the costs and because of the practical drawbacks with a large transducer.

Rickard

Roddy · « **Reply #20 on:** August 25, 2012, 02:23:48 PM »

Rickard,Offroad, I asked Humminbird to sell me a few in years gone by, no way !

The Two methods I use is eather cut the ends off EXT cables or Water Proof Cannon Plugs.

When are You going to post a pin out for "THE HUMMINRANCE"

transduser ?

Roddy

offroad · « **Reply #21 on:** August 25, 2012, 05:46:17 PM »

Quote from: Roddy on August 25, 2012, 02:23:48 PM

Rickard,Offroad, I asked Humminbird to sell me a few in years gone by, no way ! The Two methods I use is eather cut the ends off EXT cables or Water Proof Cannon Plugs.

When are You going to post a pin out for "THE HUMMINRANCE" transduser ?

Roddy

Soon Roody soon . Every step of the way has been documented, Just a case of putting it together in a format that people can understand. The next step is that l have a 898 on the bow, The images on that are no way as good as the 1197. So.... its tranducer is on the trolling motor but to run this system you need two transducers so trying to work out a way to mount them will be a challenge

reddog · « **Reply #22 on:** August 25, 2012, 05:52:30 PM »

I'm guessing that this will have the associated engineers scratching their heads..

If the image is better in Humviewer than on the OEM screen could one assume that the images would be better with a second (hd) monitor in the boat also..

offroad · « **Reply #23 on:** August 25, 2012, 06:10:44 PM »

When l tried the 2nd screen option it looked no better than the unit , What Rickard was saying l think ? When you play back the recordings on a Computer the pixel count is higher than the unit . l forgot to take my SD card yesterday when l went out. But next time l go l shall take some images from the unit .....Not using Humviewer

T.G · « **Reply #24 on:** August 25, 2012, 09:03:10 PM »

T.G.: Yes, 2D is there. It's provided by the 2D downward/depth sensing channel. You need that channel to control ping rate in the system, so it's a necessary feature. All views in the unit are still there. The only difference from normal is the enhanced SI and DI image quality.

Rickard
[/quote]

thank you

offroad · « **Reply #25 on:** August 25, 2012, 11:57:55 PM »

Have a look if you please https://vimeo.com/48223633

Rickard · « **Reply #26 on:** August 26, 2012, 03:05:52 AM »

Nice video!
I assume frequency is 455 kHz and range is set to about 23 m (70 feet) like in the previous images. My results are similar and I would point at the eveness of the 'illumination' of the sea floor and the absence of interference ridges, plus the detail in the whole scanned area. Do you remember the sensitivity setting?

(The videos generated with the free (thanks again Martin!) Humviewer get less contrast than snapshots from the same program, and Humviewer does not provide the same detail as SiView and SonarTRX, and possibly DrDepth. However, Humviewer show significantly more detail than what's presented on the unit display and in unit screenshots. I think Humviewer is well suited for quick reviewing, but not for ultimate documentation of detail. But this is another subject.)

Rickard

Roddy · « **Reply #27 on:** August 26, 2012, 01:54:49 PM »

Reddog, I use a High-Res High-Def 26" LED that makes hours and hours of bottom study EZ on the eyes.

It is all in the screen PIX count, more PIX better screen shot.

Roddy

abraquelebout · « **Reply #28 on:** August 26, 2012, 04:15:00 PM »

hi all
i see rickard experiences , great and interesting
Tomorrow i'm going to test a lss2 with a 898 unit
i mount the lss2 on a towfish and i project to go on a part of know river.
i make rickard connect
test the lss2 at 455 and 800 khz.
i'm waiting this day since a long time......tomorrow

newkid4si · « **Reply #29 on:** August 26, 2012, 05:29:38 PM »

offroad
Thanks for posting the video. At ---TIME ( in rec ) 00:10:06 or 3:24 in progress bar at bottom,
anyone have thoughts on the shadows in front of what appears to be weeds?
The shadows are in front and behind the weeds.

Mike

offroad · « **Reply #30 on:** August 26, 2012, 05:42:28 PM »

Mike
Yes l saw them two Barramundi l think

newkid4si · « **Reply #31 on:** August 26, 2012, 09:26:25 PM »

To quote the famous line in the movie "Jaws", I think we need a bigger boat!
Nice fish!

Mike

offroad · « **Reply #32 on:** August 26, 2012, 11:34:54 PM »

Went out today and took some snapshot shots These are the raw images, nothing has been changed In a couple of shots you can see a bouy and its line
http://s787.photobucket.com/albums/yy159/Awoonga/SI%20Image/

Enufzed · « **Reply #33 on:** August 27, 2012, 01:42:46 AM »

Offroad
Did you receive my PM with all details included
Enufzed

offroad · « **Reply #34 on:** August 27, 2012, 02:00:50 AM »

replied to pm

News:

Author Topic: Time to Reveal all ! (Read 21678 times)

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